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Author Topic: To GMO or not?  (Read 475 times)

Offline Dutch-Hunter

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To GMO or not?
« on: August 30, 2018, 05:32:24 PM »
Are you a GMO’er or a non-GMO’er? Consider your answer carefully.

GMO Fact: Genetically modified organisms (GMOs) are living organisms whose genetic material has been artificially manipulated through genetic engineering. This creates combinations of plant, animal, bacteria, and virus genes that do not occur in nature.

Do you prefer your watermelon seedless?

Is your favorite grape seedless?

Ever had a granny smith apple?

Do you love all the colors roses bloom in?

Were you happy the first time you enjoyed a burpless cucumber?

Is the sweetest and best tasting sweet corn come bi-colored?

Do you like your tomato slice as large as your hamburger patty?

If you answered yes to any of the above questions you ARE a GMO’er!
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Offline MI_Bowhunter

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2018, 06:04:42 PM »
Its darn near impossible to totally avoid it any more but I try avoid it where I can.
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Online yari

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #2 on: August 30, 2018, 06:24:07 PM »
anyone that is on the fence, I always ask if they like honey crisp apples. they have no clue what they are objecting to. they just hop on the liberal bandwagon. I've changed many minds with that simple question
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Offline NWIAdeerhunter

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2018, 06:24:29 PM »
I am GMO all the way, all the anti GMO stuff is nothing but lies if you ask me! And yes I like my beef corn fed!
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Offline Madgomer

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2018, 07:13:36 PM »
We've been hybridizing plants & animals to improve certain genetic traits for centuries, and I would generally state that mankind is better for it.  Is GMO really anything different than that at the end of the day?  I wouldn't say my concern is zero with GMO, but the fanatical hype by some of these anti-GMO people is absurd, at the end of the day they're just one more group out there trying to cash in (books, etc) or get their 15 minutes of fame by making outlandish claims they cannot support with facts & data (and a whole lotta clueless sheep just keep buying in).  Should the potential dangers be evaluated with scientific methods?  Sure, I have no problem with that, as long as the fanatics go off in a quiet corner somewhere while the facts are revealed.
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Offline BLUETOE

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2018, 09:02:13 AM »
I don't know anyway around it unless you grow your own food and then the seeds you are more than likely GMO'ed. They have been doing it for years- breeding chickens that get so big by 6 mo of age their legs can't hold them up things like that  so I guess most of us are GMO'ers by default.  @--0--0117 @--0--0117
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Offline Hunt Master

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2018, 09:47:07 AM »
Here is the thing to keep in mind. Whether you are Pro or Anti GMO, you need to understand that a hybrid plant (or a cross bred animal) and a genetically modified organism are not the same thing, even though most people treat them the same. There is a difference between cross pollinating different apple species to come up with a new and better tasting, more prolific apple and scientifically inserting a gene into a DNA strain to make a plant resistant to drought, pests, and herbicides and then patenting that process or species.

Like MIB said, it is hard to get away from GMO because almost all of our wheat, corn and soybeans (in this country) are GMO. Here is a story I experienced.. The farmer that farmed one of our leases decided to start growing organic corn and soybeans to move into a different market. They used chicken litter for fertilizer and did not spray pesticides or herbicides. All of this grain would be going to companies to make "Organic" products for the public. However, when I asked him if he was using different seed for this process, his answer was no. They still planted the same GMO corn and beans they had always used. That told me that if someone buys "organic", thinking they are getting a healthier product, they probably don't know they are still getting a GMO product.

Now you have to look at harm vs benefit for actual GMO products. GMO has allowed for more grain to be produced on less ground. this is important when it comes to feeding people around the world. It is also easier on the farmer because less cultivating and hassle is involved in growing, harvesting, separating and cleaning GMO grain. On the other side, it is very hard to get to the truth on health risks. this is because all of the studies by pro GMO companies and organizations say there is no health risk and all of the studies from anti GMO says there are great health risks. There is no way for the average person to say true or false. Also, there is the pressure on farmers from the GMO side to NEVER talk bad about GMO.

With the recent judgement against a very large GMO company where a jury said that glyphosate causes cancer has opened up another door. Scientist have proven that consuming food sprayed with glyphosate leaves a small trace of that chemical in the human body. If glyphosate really is harmful to the human body, whether absorbed through the skin or ingested, that is bad. if glyphosate isnt harmful, then its not a problem. Now we are back to the scientific studies. Who can the average joe believe? the studies from the pro GMO groups or the anti GMO groups? Both have large money and power behind them... if glyphosate does cause cancer or other health issues, then its not really the GMO product that is bad but the chemicals used on the plants that the GMO process allows to be used... Now we are starting to see glyphosate resistant weeds that is causing farmers (and food plotter) to have to use stronger doses. Good? Bad? Unknown?

Another side to this GMO argument, that I have experienced, is as a beekeeper. Colony collapse disorder is a major problem with honey bee keepers. In fact, since I have moved to Kentucky, I have lost many of my bee hives each year. I never lost one in Alabama but I also lived nowhere near any corn, wheat or bean fields like I do now. Last year I lost them all and I have finally quit trying. Now, even beekeepers argue about the cause. Some believe it is a rise in mites. Some believe it is crop spraying. Some believe that the genetically built in pest control of GMO products is the issue. This group believes that the pollen from GMO plants, which is fed to bee larva, is poisoning them. France believed this so much they banned GMO farming and their bee population came back 100%. Coincidence or fact? I have no idea. All I know is I cant seem to keep bees alive in Kentucky farm country.

What do i believe?

>  I believe money makes policy in this country and not true benefit / harm facts
>  I believe that there are many "Banned" products that we were once told were not harmful by scientific studies (DDT, Asbestos, Liberalism...)
>  I believe other countries are looking harder at this than we are because of the money involved
>  I believe it takes a long time for true health risks, related to a product, to show themselves and be believed

So, while this is a big issue to argue about, no one side can convince the other because the true facts are always obscured by power, fear and money. You have to make up your own mind and follow your beliefs...
« Last Edit: August 31, 2018, 01:50:55 PM by Hunt Master »
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Offline treefarmer

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2018, 10:02:10 AM »
I know folks on both side of this argument and some of them are like, as was stated, sheep, what ever is politically correct or in the mainstream news they follow with abandon.  "Global warming" for example has now become "climate change" to make up for some of the erroneous information that has been poured out by the tree huggers for years. 
There was a term used back when I was a lot younger, hybrid vigor.  Back then we used the term to describe the best of both species that had been combined, both plants and animal.  The example that I'm thinking about is the development of the Santa Gertrudis breed of cattle.  A 3/8 Brahma and 5/8 Shorthorn cross became a great beef animal, the Brahma being a different critter, Bos indicus and the Shorthorn being Bos taurus.  They could survive eating pine bark and sunshine (the Brahma side) and they could produce quality meat (the Shorthorn side).  Many new breeds exist with the Brahma blood foundation.  As most of you know the breeders can breed the horns off of cattle, thus we have polled cattle. 
The same holds true with plants that our farmers and ranchers want to be productive by surviving harsh elements from time to time, drought resistant plants, disease resistant plants, insect/pest resistant plants.  This is our world, food, fiber, fuel, etc.  Most oranges you eat are grown on a sour root stock with a sweet orange graft in a nursery somewhere.  Pine trees are developed to survive certain soils to produce more fiber more quickly to we can have more wood for building, paper for all its' uses, resins, etc..
I'll just say Amen to Madgomer's post and get off my soap box.
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Offline Hunt Master

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2018, 10:05:24 AM »
Not quite ready to quit preaching...  LOL

Another side to this..

As Americans, we like to have our cake and eat it too. In fact, we like control over the whole cake factory and we want it to be free cake.

Americans complain about our dependency of on foreign oil but we also complain when gas prices rise because domestic oil is more expensive

Americans complain about China's trade policies and how much product they ship to America but they also flock to walmart to buy those cheap china products

Americans complain about steroids and antibiotics in their chickens but then complain about the higher prices of free range chicken

Americans complain about other countries taking over the steel industries and jobs but then complain when their can of soda goes up because of aluminum costs.

Americans complain about many, many things they see as wrong but when those things are fixed, but come with a higher consumer price tag, they complain about that.

GMO products, good or bad, do bring higher yields. Higher yields bring lower prices. IF GMO products are outlawed tomorrow, all corn, wheat and soybean products will cost more and then people will complain about that.

My grand daddy used to say, you can have quality or you can have cheap. Both have pros and cons. But what you can never have is cheap and quality... That goes for our food supply as well...
« Last Edit: August 31, 2018, 01:40:05 PM by Hunt Master »
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Offline Madgomer

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #9 on: August 31, 2018, 09:14:10 PM »
Can't disagree with anything you've stated HM.  For us it was three things:  You want it fast, cheap, and high quality, but you can only get two out of the three at best in any scenario.  Your statement about the inability of the average Joe to know what to believe when opposing sides are both claiming the facts support their arguments is so true and so aggravating.  I will say in general though that in cases when I've been close enough to an issue to know for certain what the facts are, it's generally the liberal whiner side that is blowing smoke.  Doesn't mean that's always the case, and your info on the bees may be a great case in point on that. 

Odd that you mention the bees by the way.  Our neighbors (about a quarter mile away) have raised bees for years but this year it's like all of the honeybees disappeared.  Our raspberry patches are just full of bumblebees but those patches & the clover all around and my sunflowers don't have a honeybee to be found.  Have been wondering what the heck has happened - need to stop by & talk the them about it & see what they know.
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Offline Dutch-Hunter

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2018, 07:36:41 AM »
The point I was trying to make is, Genetic modification has been happening for a few thousand years. Yes hybridization however achieved is still modifying to make better. The demand for cheap better food is the driving force. The fact also remains that the people that raise food for a living are severely under-paid for their effort. They are also the first to get blamed when there is a problem or shortage. For instance; now days the majority of our poultry products are treated chemically to kill bacteria which would have been killed if proper cooking techniques were used by the consumer. Another example; dairy industry has been "genetically" manipulating the breeds to get more production and better animals. Yet the price presently being paid to the dairy farmers for their toil is the same price paid 35 years ago. What if any consumer products are the same price as 35 years ago? If all business's were run as efficiently as farming the world would be a better place.
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Offline Dutch-Hunter

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2018, 07:47:27 AM »
A final statement and I'll get off my soapbox.

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Offline Madgomer

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2018, 07:56:35 AM »
[quote author=Dutch-Hunter link=topic=46614.msg699364#msg699364 date=1
Yet the price presently being paid to the dairy farmers for their toil is the same price paid 35 years ago. What if any consumer products are the same price as 35 years ago? If all business's were run as efficiently as farming the world would be a better place.
[/quote]
Very true DH, there are very few examples in modern society of that level of efficiency gain with so little reward to the producers.  Also the driver behind the disappearance of the small family farm - if those guys and gals can't scale up their operation in terms of acres and/or herd size, they simply cannot create positive cash flow.  Most consumers take all of it for granted.
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Offline Flintlock1776

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Re: To GMO or not?
« Reply #13 on: September 02, 2018, 06:06:10 PM »
At my age with all the preservatives, additives, fortified and using margarine use back in the day before we knew what it was made of , I dont think I’ll worry about GMO or no. It is  on my worry list
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