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Author Topic: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions  (Read 135 times)

Offline Gutshot

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Offline Snortweeze

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2017, 09:40:37 AM »
Antler points do not always tell the whole story. One of the biggest bucks I ever harvested was a old over the hill buck which only had 5 points. But with that being said  there can be width rules. I am a big advocate of letting young bucks walk and giving them a chance to grow.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2017, 09:42:28 AM by Snortweeze »
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Offline dave 1211

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2017, 12:18:47 PM »
I can see both sides but up here most young bucks get taken out by cars I will shoot a small buck if it the end of mz season and I have no meat
time to start the food plots for them deer




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Offline Madgomer

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2017, 03:30:15 PM »
I can see both sides too, but will say from personal experience on several different properties that the QDM practices make a huge difference.  I know to many people any deer is a trophy, but I haven't seen much that gets my adrenaline going like time in the stand when you are seeing multiple good bucks going about their business.  Ultimately I would expect the property owners are going to have to make it happen, and that will be an incremental process as more of them see the benefits in the herd.  Even though deer don't pay attention to property lines, every little bit helps.  If I'm out with a brand new hunter, I'll consider having them take a small buck if the situation demands it, but once they've put that one down, they're expected to use some reasonable restraint. 
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Offline Flintlock1776

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2017, 03:52:56 PM »
Once PA went to antler restrictions, the racks improved. I rememberthe early 80's , a spike was down. With the restriction the antlers improved
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Offline King Ben

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2017, 04:15:36 PM »
I'm right on board with Madgomer.  To me, it is all about the age.  Some deer do not have the genetic make-up for width, some do not have the genetic make-up for points. 

Offline MI_Bowhunter

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2017, 05:17:40 PM »
I was initially opposed, now I'm on the fence. Hunting to me has never really been about the size of the rack. I don't have acess to places where I can plant large plots nor do I have the equipment if I did. I also do not have the many hours of time or resources in trail cams to target the big boys. If I get a monster its just luck of being in the right place at the right time.

That said I have been doing a lot of thinking on this. While it will hurt deer harvests in the first couple years, after that you should start seeing larger bucks.

We also allow two bucks a season. One is any buck ( some areas do have local aprs) and the second is restricted to 4 points on one side. The argument on this is that if most  people only get one tag they will just shoot the first buck they see which has the same effect as the two tags as most never tag the second buck.

If they are going to do it then just grant one buck tag with aprs and eliminate the second buck tag.

Where I hunt in upper Michigan they do have aprs in effect if you buy the combo license (two tags), but none if you buy the single tag.  This has been the rule there for a couple years now. I never did see a buck in the daylight last fall but most if not all of the bucks on camera were 4 points or bigger.  Most seasons I rarely saw a deer up there bigger than a spike.  The years when we have bad whether is when people get the big deer as it pushes them into thicker cover.

This are is also one of the lower populated areas around and the state does not issue any doe tags for the area.  MI DNR allows doe with a bow using any regular tag but due to low numbers the org that owns the property where I hunt does not allow hunting of does at all.  (This is why I have been hunting more downstate and looking for my own property)

In many areas we can buy practicaly unlimited doe tags. A group of 4 hunters just down from where I hunt took over 20 deer in the two week gun season (as relayed to me by my buddy who lives near there) Thats a lot of deer esp if this is happening at each square mile farm plot.

There is a lot of pushback from hunters and auto insurance companies to keep the deer harvest numbers up and it appears the NRC (Natural Resources Commission) has caved.  I will enjoy the hunt regardless so in the end I will go along with whatever.....as long as I can keep hunting.
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Offline Madgomer

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2017, 06:23:41 PM »
I'm right on board with Madgomer.  To me, it is all about the age.  Some deer do not have the genetic make-up for width, some do not have the genetic make-up for points.
That's a very valid point Ben - - I often take for granted that I happen to be living in the middle of great genetics and great nutrition, so big bucks "come easy" here relative to a lot of other areas.  Even before QDM became popular, a lot of folks around here (myself included) have managed to put some trophies on the wall that were more based on luck than skill and planning.
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Offline MichiganLouie

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2017, 07:17:52 PM »
I have never purchased a combo license, which in MI, the 2nd tag specifies you must shoot a 4pt on the side or larger.  There are no restrictions if you purchase the one buck tag.  The reason for not buying the combo tag, is that I very seldom see that many bucks in my property. (last fall, I only saw 2 bucks during the firearm deer season. which is 16 days long)  I don't hunt deer anywhere else.  It's not like I'm not out hunting, as I go deer hunting every day except sundays during the firearm deer seasons.  Last couple of years, I hunt both mornings and afternoons whenever possible, until I tag out.  So I do spend a lot of time out in the blind looking for deer traffic.  So coming from that viewpoint, I feel APR's would put a damper on my deer hunting. 
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Offline russcat

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2017, 02:50:44 PM »
I'm an advocate of antler restrictions. It has worked in Texas.  But here it isn't based on points. 

The research that led to our antler restrictions revealed width is the only thing consistently related to age. Age was the focus from the beginning, not getting bigger racks. Research has proven bucks 3-1/2 years and older have a dramatically higher success rate breeding does. So how do we get more bucks to the age of 3-1/2 years old and older?  Their research showed the average 3-1/2 old buck had antlers that were a min of 13" in width.  The younger bucks rarely had antlers this wide but often had more points than bucks older than them. So to get more bucks to breeding age to help the overall health of the deer herd, Texas started antler restrictions based on width.  Now we have more mature bucks and naturally larger antlers.  The larger antlers were never the goal but since mass and width are related to age the larger antlers came naturally with having more mature bucks roaming. 

I have seen it work first hand. Fannin County rarely ever produced anything over 130". A 130" buck was a big story that got around quick. But it didn't take long after the antler restrictions were put into place we started seeing more and more evidence of it working. Nowadays Fannin county commonly produces 140" and 150" bucks with the occasional B&C bucks being reported.

Me, I'm 100% convinced antler restrictions work. Especially when combined with nutrition and other common sense QDM practices. 
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Offline treefarmer

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2017, 04:04:02 PM »
Up until a couple of years ago in Florida, the only restriction, on private property, was a buck had to have one spike antler 5" above the hair line.  The WMAs have had some restrictions for a while.  The Game Commission divided the state into zones and each zone has different antler restrictions.  In our particular zone, a child under 15 can still kill a 5" spike, all other hunters are allowed to kill a buck but it must have at least a fork or 2 points on one side.  There are 11 other zones and each has its' own requirement or antler restriction.
It seems everybody wants to kill a "trophy" deer and the only way to achieve their goal is to let the young ones walk.  Personally, I don't really care, you can't eat the horns but I'll most certainly abide by the rules they lay down.  It is a fact that clubs on large leases, have greatly increased the size of their bucks by establishing a point rule or a size rule, outside the ears, etc.  On a small lease or farm it wont work.  You let one walk, he jumps the fence and a neighbor shoots him.  You've lost your prospective "wall hanger", your neighbor has a buck in the freezer. ##$%#1119
Florida has only a few doe days each year, broken up now in our area over a few weeks.  Used have a full week, when that was changed, it was changed to "allow more people to participate and to reduce the harvest". We still have does running out our ears. @--0--0117  The kicker is, any property over 640 acres can get numerous doe tags to be used at any time during the season.  I guess the state figures some one with a small farm doesn't deserve to thin out the ol' nannies like the big boys do. ???
My hunting has begun to slow down because of a thing called age and I hope because of these new rules and regulations, all these young hunters are able to kill a wall hanger every time they get in the woods. 
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Offline yari

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Re: Michigan said NO to Antler Restrictions
« Reply #11 on: July 17, 2017, 04:09:17 PM »
I do it on a personal level. it's more of a personal thing IMO. if you have private property, do what you want. i'd hate to say no to any deer for a youth. they need to start somewhere and have a good chance of success
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