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Author Topic: 358 Winchester  (Read 397 times)

Offline BoBallistic

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358 Winchester
« on: May 24, 2015, 08:17:04 AM »
Was reloading one of the 338 Federal yesterday and was looking though all my reloading manuals for another load for the 215 gn & 225 gn loads. I think my load is close but there is always something better out there that I did not try yet...I was studying the loads and running them through the QuickLoad ballistic program to study pressure, burn rate times, velocities and energy, when I turned the page and saw the 358 Winchester. After looking over I thought to myself, what a perfect Black Bear and Hog load. At close range (200 yards and under) it has enough energy to put the smack down on a ELK....should flatten a hog for sure.

If you are not familiar with the 358 Win you are not along. This round was developed in 1955 but quickly faded out when the 350 Rem and Norma Mags were developed. I went to Gunbroker.com and saw where you can still get the 358 Win from new Cooper's and Browning BLR and a few others manufacturers. It is another member of the 308 family, it is simply a necked up 308.  I have a 35 Remington in a 336C and love this caliber. Heck I will grab it over a 30-30 for my up close hunting rifle. Yes we hunt in some thick woods, just asked Split, Deerhead, Metalman and Cobbguy. That 35 Rem has sent a few deer to the cooler for me and they all have been found within 50 yards of where they have been standing (a few has been knocked off their feet). But the 35 Rem in 336C has its limits. There is two types of 35 bullets, one that is made for rifles (pointed tips) and the other ones made for T/C's and Marlins.     

My goodness look at the 35 family, it goes back to the 35 Whelen (1922), the 350 Remington (1965) and the 350 Norma Mag (1959). All of which will take down any North America Game, including the Big Bears!!

I bet you could really load up some nice accurate loads 200, 215 or the 225 gn for the 358 Win using probably some 4064, RL12 or H338. They would be around 2100 to 2200 fps velocity. I might looked into a Cooper M54 and see what happens...

If anyone out there has a 358 Win, please let us all know how you like it and pass on some stories you have about it....what a great but almost forgotten round this is....
« Last Edit: May 24, 2015, 01:52:45 PM by BoBallistic »
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Offline Dutch-Hunter

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Re: 358 Winchester
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2015, 05:39:12 AM »
Bro Bo... Obscure rifle cartridges... A look back is always fun, wondering why they never really caught on or what were they thinking. There's the single most fascinating aspect of the countless chambering's. Take the 505 Gibbs and all the offspings it fathered. Yet you hear very little about it nowadays. Then think about all the wildcats that have come and gone. The 243 Catbird could have died off if it wasn't for Kenny Jarrett's fondness of it. Or the 308 Warbird and Blackbird by Lazzeroni. This would make interesting reading while on stand. You know me a my attraction to the "not normal" stuff. Normal is boring after all. At least from behind these eyeballs anyway.
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Offline BoBallistic

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Re: 358 Winchester
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2015, 06:19:10 AM »
Dutch - First of all...THANK YOU for your service and sacrifice that you have endured over your life. We as proud Americans owe it to folks like you who have given it all the freedoms we have and enjoy today....THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!!! Thank you to all the veterans on TH.. If it were not for you guys/gals the world would be much more dangerous that it is today....
 ##$%#115

You have it right, all those cartridges and their history are amazing..the 404 Jeffery is the one that comes to mind where it is the parent case of all the WSM's we shoot today! Amazing...I have a book on European cartridges and it is an interesting read...I glance at it every now and then, but it is a great reference book....

I am surprise that the Lazzeroni cartridges did not make it..whether it was lack of advertising or distribution/production problems, no one will every know...but the 308 Warbird almost became part of my 308 collection. Just last year I mention that somewhere I have a complete list of RCBS dies and it turned out to be 2 or 3 pages, printed on both sides of the paper about 3 columns per side of available dies! What ever you can think of they had dies for it!!  --099-780

Dutch - one thing, you are not normal....LOL....that is something everyone can agree on...LOL... 

 
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Offline BoBallistic

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Re: 358 Winchester
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2015, 04:27:01 AM »
Dutch - Remember the 404 Jeffery and what it bloomed into being...that old cartridge was very inspirational in the settling of Africa Continent. When the 375H&H was developed, it superseded the 404 with it larger bullet and stopping power. The 404 was around till about the mid 50's according to my Safari guide.

The 404 was setting around until the mid 90's, the folks at Winchester started playing around with and developing a short action round that had almost the same ballistic stats as it bigger brothers. The long action magnums of today. The 270 WSM, 7mm WSM, 300 WSM and the 325 WSM were the result of reshaping the 404 Jeffery case.....     
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Offline BoBallistic

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Re: 358 Winchester
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2015, 10:25:06 AM »
Have been looking at Cooper 358 Winchester....sure would be nice just have one. Talk about a black bear stopper!! Probably end up getting one....
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Offline Madgomer

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Re: 358 Winchester
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2015, 08:10:44 PM »
Or two, or ???

 --099-780
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Offline Zos41

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Re: 358 Winchester
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2015, 08:16:58 PM »
I passed on a like new Savage model 99 in 358 years ago, due to lack of funds. I still wish I had it. A co-worker purchased it new and hunted with it 2 years in VT and only fired it when he first put a scope on it.

At the time just could not justify the money
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Offline BoBallistic

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Re: 358 Winchester
« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2015, 11:04:35 AM »
Zos - I know what you mean. Back in the day when I worked several jobs to make ends meet, I did not have the money to buy some of the classics. I would love to have a Browning BLR in 308...thank goodness they still make it....I have missed out on so many deals in the past, just makes me sick thinking about it....

Mad - Only two for sure (for now)...am going to shoot today after work (yes a four letter word) and was loading up this morning after going though and picked out what needed to be shot. The better half said that if I didn't quit buying rifles, we would have to get a bigger house....so I might start looking for bigger houses late in the summer...

The problem is that I have about 6 good quality scopes (Ziess, Leupold, Nikon, Vortex) that are not mounted on something and was thinking that a 358 would be a nice round to tinker with....but the energy at 200 yards is still impressive. The BC is not that good, and you know that a 250 gn in a 35 caliber in a 308 case the felt recoil would give you a headache....

Besides Cooper, there are several other manufacturers that make the 358 Winchester. Already looking at dies, cases and bullets for it....

Dutch - You are so right, the old cartridges of the past are fund to ticker with. I have an old 35 Rem in a Marlin 336C and that caliber has a very interesting past. And lets not over look the 30-30 Winchester...wow, talk about a classic round....


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Offline BLUETOE

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Re: 358 Winchester
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2015, 01:43:38 PM »
My buddy had a .358 in a Savage 99. Kicked like a mule!!!! It was accurate, did I mention it kicked like a mule ;D He did manage to shoot a nice Pa bear with it- Needless to say 1 shot killed it DEAD and split his eyebrow to the tune of 3 stitches(he got to close to the scope in all of the excitement, bear running out of the drive and all)  ;D Bear weighed 288 dressed. He sold it that year because after you fired it twice the second casing would not eject- like the case was swelling. That being said my experience says the .358 would be awesome for hogs and bear but I reckin' you kill just about anything with it if it was close enough.
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