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Tools of the Trade => Firearms => Topic started by: notsams on September 05, 2016, 07:16:08 PM

Title: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 05, 2016, 07:16:08 PM
       Cabelas has the Rem 700 Varmint rifles on sale. All black ADL style with 26 inch heavy barrel. .223, 22-250 and 308 win. Cabelas sale is $100 off and a $50 Rem mail in rebate means $350 for a new Rem 700. I'm thinking a 308 Win and some Berger VLDS. If the rifle shoots under an inch I will have a custom turret made for it and try it out at 1000 yards. All I'm going to do for now is put a good stiff vertical grip stock on it and break in the barrel properly. My brother is going to give me 20 rounds of brass and borrow me a set of dies for it because if it doesn't shoot good I will have it rebarreled to a 6.5 Creedmore. I'm going to buy the rifle and then slowly work on the project. I do have a 4.5-14x40 scope to put on it so It won't take long to find out if it shoots. I hope to find a good stock for under $350. The sale starts on the 8th and then the project begins.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 06, 2016, 06:43:54 AM
Not - Congrats on the rifle "project"....go ahead and take the plunge! At that price, $350 that IS a good price!!! What a 308? Humm, I don't know anyone here that has one of those!! Just kidding, I bought my first 700 BDL in Varmint configuration. I bought in in the summer of 1980. At that time, it was rare that you found a 26" barrel on anything except custom built rifles. My barrel is a 24". Since I have purchase the rifle, it has gone through a lot of changes, just like what you have planned....

First things is to put a trigger in it, My has a Shilen Trigger in it set at 2.75 lbs. Then fine a good stock to put on it. Then put good optics on it. Are you planning on making this a bench rifle or a hunting rifle? long range? A 1000 yard rifle? You will need a good custom barrel to get out to a 1000 yards and still hold good groups. The factory barrel will be good out to 500 to 600 yards for some decent groups. But beyond that, then you will need a custom barrel.

If you choose 308, the Remington barrel will have 10" twist in it (you might want to measure it to be sure). For a 26" barrel, I would stick to 168 to 175 grain Berger VLDs, I would try Varget, 4064, 4166, RL15, AA2015 and Viht 140 and/or 540 powder. I have and it just depend of what the rifle likes. I use Lapua Brass for all of my 308's and CCI-BR2 primers. Start out by seating them about .020" off the lans and go from there. Some rifle will like it closer to the lans and some farther...every rifle has its own personality and it is your job to find out what it likes, not what you like to shoot in it!! Your brass, you need to start out buy using good brass, like Lapua, Norma, Nosler. Don't use unknown brass that you don't know how many times it has been shot?? You want to give the rifle a chance that it can shoot good! Barrel break-in, with a brand new barrel, I would suggest that you do 40 rounds before trying to group. Be sure to order you tons of new patches and another bottle of solvent. Get out to the range early one morning and staying late and do this one time. This is how I normally do this. With a use rifle, but new to me, I normally do 20 to 25 rounds, cleaning after each shot.
 
If you choose another caliber, I can help you too, just let us know. The only criticism I have is that you should have been doing this in March not now, but Remington and Gander Mountain, has made it appealing to buy it now. Don't be in any hurry to get this one out on the range. Just do it right....

Remember you build a rifle around one bullet, not the other way around. If you want to build a 1000 yard rifle, that would be nice, but it would not be a hunting rifle, but a bench rifle. Your optics a 4.5x 14 isn't enough for a 1000 yard rifle, 500 to 600 yards is more like it. I have shot 600 yards several times this year and might do it again before hunting season starts. Make sure you Picatinny Rail has at least 20 MOA built in for the drop of either the 308 or 6.5 Creedmoor...You will find after it is all said and done, that you will spend over a grand or more on this rifle getting it set up the way you want too.

Just trying to help out here...I have been there and done that a number of times.....Bo 
 







Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 06, 2016, 07:31:58 PM
  Thanks for the info Bo. The rifle is going to be a bench gun. If I could buy it in a 6.5 creedmore for $350 I would but thought I would experiment with a 308 then probably rebarrel it to 6.5 Creedmore. I will probably only be using the action on this rifle.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 07, 2016, 12:19:58 AM
Not - Sounds like a winter type project. Thanks for the input, knew it had to be something other than a hunting rifle.....LOL...keep us posted on your build and all the steps you are going through...would like to know how you are coming along with it.....
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 07, 2016, 09:51:32 AM
Good price and great project let us know how it goes.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 12, 2016, 08:52:44 PM
  So on the 8th at 9am I called Cabelas and bought the rifle. On the 10th I drove the 100 miles to pick up the rifle but after filling out the background check I was DELAYED. Not denied but DELAYED. So after spending 3 hours shopping at other stores I returned to Cabelas and was told to call back in 5 days to see If I have been approved to pick up the gun I have paid for. I asked if there was a phone number I could call to express my displeasure about the situation but they said there was no such number. I almost asked for my money back but I figure that is what the feds would want.   I kept my opinions to my self and drove the 100 miles home without the rifle.  Thursday I will call to see if I can pick up the rifle I already paid for.   Oh by the way I have a permit to carry and have never even had as much as a speeding tickit.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 12, 2016, 09:31:12 PM
Sorry to hear that - sadly I've actually expected stuff like this to start happening long ago - the bureaucrats have so many ways to make life difficult for us it's ridiculous.  Hang in there.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 12, 2016, 10:23:25 PM
i have bought 5 this year 2 at gander mountain and 3 at walmart
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 13, 2016, 06:21:15 AM
Not was it Gander Mtn or the BATF that caused you the delay?? I know Gander is hurting for Business and was wonder if they use this tactic on a few customers in order for them to stay in the store to buy some merchandise...The management at any Gander Mtn Store will say that is the Government and nothing they can do about it, shrug their shoulders and go on. Believe me the store managers are really not into hunting or fishing or camping, they are interested in sales only!!! 

When I bought my Remington LTR way back in the dark ages, I was delayed about 2 hours. It was late when I submitted the paperwork and was wondering if the BATF was low on personnel that processes the paper work or maybe it was during a long dinner break...but I did end up buy a few more things at Knob Creek...LOL... 

Like PA, have bought firearms from them before and had no problem but that was many years ago.....but I have never bought any firearms from Walmart...Hum....



Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 13, 2016, 06:28:35 AM
shotguns and 22s mainly
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 13, 2016, 07:53:00 AM
the delay was from NICS the call center where they called your paperwork in at. happens all the time. I have my permit too, but if I don't use it when I buy a gun, I also get delayed.  The only way your permit helps you is if you purchase the gun in the same state you live in.  It sucks I've been there.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 13, 2016, 07:12:08 PM
I was at  Cabelas and told them I have a permit and I was in the same state as my permit was issued. The salesmen and his supervisor apologized but said there was nothing they could do.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 13, 2016, 07:51:01 PM
Haven't bought any guns from Wally World, but none of those stores around here carry guns any more (probably haven't for 10 years or so).  Have bought a couple from Gander when they have big sales, no issues, but haven't done it recently.  I'm sure O'Dumbo and his band of merry men are encouraging the BATF to drag their feet on processing background checks.  Haven't tried buying any from Cabelas, but bro in law does regularly & hasn't mentioned problems there.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 15, 2016, 08:53:35 AM
I was at  Cabelas and told them I have a permit and I was in the same state as my permit was issued. The salesmen and his supervisor apologized but said there was nothing they could do.

maybe your state is different there here, or cabelas doesn't understand the 4473 form, but there is a section on there for background check identification, its required when you purchase a handgun. I think I would have asked to transfer the gun to my local FFL dealer, paid the transfer fee, that way I wouldn't have to drive the 100 miles back when it comes through.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 20, 2016, 07:39:04 PM
   I got the rifle. The Cabelas employee told me about 40% of gun background checks are Delayed lately. I dismantled the rifle and adjusted the trigger to 2.5 lbs. It is definitely a production rifle. It has a few issues that I can improve but in the end it is probably going to end up as parts anyway. I'm going to put it away for a while because I'm going Elk hunting in 3 weeks. I'm only going to handle my Elk gun now so I am familiar with it. I have been shooting it on and off all summer.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on April 16, 2017, 08:04:02 PM
    I finally picked up the .308 again. I picked up a used stock at a gun show that has aluminum pillars for $50. Then a drop floor plate for $60 from a gunsmith. Now the rifle is a BDL not a ADL. The stock is a Hogue with a soft rubber texture but it does have a "semi" vertical grip and is way more rigid then the original stock. I had some rings and bases on hand so I mounted them. This weekend I am going to mount and level the scope and begin the break in process. I will sight it in 2 inches high at 100 yards and if I get good groups I will work my way out to 500 yards by turning "up" the turret. This is a budget build. As of now I have $460 into the improved rifle. I want to see what long range accuracy I can get for $460.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on April 17, 2017, 07:02:49 AM
Not congrats on the find and the amount of money you have in it....Wow good deal!!! Now you are going to have to find what pill or bullet it likes...I know my 308's vary from rifle to rifle....in my 308 Rem Varmint, it has 10 twist in the barrel, actually 10.125" by my "super scientific" measurements. I shoot the 168 gn Burgers in it and get great groups out of it...I would like to try some 175 in it.....attached is the last year target I shot at the range...it was only at 100 yards, but with that dime size group and some tweaking of the load it should be just fine.......

Please post some before and after pictures of your project....it will be interesting to see what it likes..... 
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on April 17, 2017, 08:06:03 PM
Notsams, I have a 700 that I changed the blind magazine to a drop floor plate, I call it my ADL+1/2.  The drop plate I used came off a 700 chambered for 7mm Mag. 

BTW, our local Walmart has a couple of Savage Axis rifles for $269 plus tax.  I would love to pick up the one chambered for .223, but highly doubt I could get this past my CFO.  lol.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on April 20, 2017, 06:15:27 AM
Not - Be sure to post some pictures so we can follow the progress of your build....I too have been looking into a good bolt action 223...Gutshot's Remington 700 SPS he had at last years Summerblast was amazing accurate...

I purchased a demo McWhorter rifle (that what they told me) from Tim down in Doerun, GA (talk about middle of no where, I mean dirt road trip!!) and it had a 26" Kreiger Barrel with a McWhorter Custom Break, Stiller Action, Jewel Trigger, HS Precision Stock in 270WSM...about half price of what a new one would cost. At that time, I was thinking about a custom build myself with either a Shilen or Kreiger barrel, Stiller or Surgeon Action, Jewell trigger, McMillan stock when I found this one...so I was lucky to find it at a decent price...They McWhorter furnished me with two boxes of custom ammo for it and believe me it wasn't custom ammo. They went to the Nosler Book and loaded up the most accurate round for some 140 gn Accubonds....I shot them up and saved the brass...it was not the right load for this rifle. I did some experimenting around with powder and loads and seating depths and finally found the right load for this rifle, but it has taken me almost 7 years to find the right load and wanting to shoot this rifle. The moral of this story is not to be in any hurry to build a custom rifle and to do your research into your project which Louie has done, and then look around for a good used rifle with the components close to what you want....

I also have a custom Cooper that it took 9 months to get here! and cost over $4500...this one shoots great!!! of course it is in a 308...Shot it one time last year at the Summerblast 2016 at 325 yards and hit the 12" plate....but it was to my specs...short and sweet!!! amazing groups at 200 yards...

Louie - I have many Remington's 700 that I thought about doing what you are doing. On my 308 700 Varmint did put a drop box magazine in it about 10 years ago and a McMillan Stock on it about 20 years ago, did the same for the 7mm-08 both has the same stock, scope and DBM....Did the same for the five original blue Senderos back in the 90's.....They are so many things you can do with a Remington 700 just like the little Ruger 10/22...so many things you can do to trick it out...have fun but please post some pictures for us to see...thanks...

 
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on April 23, 2017, 02:02:47 PM
    So I finally got 20 rounds loaded for the 308. I got 30 empty brass and used the in laws dies. I used Benchmark powder, Rem primers, 168 gr BTHPs and some new, but old herters brass. I bore sighted the rifle. So far I have fired 7 shots through the rifle and I cleaned the barrel between every shot. 1st shot hit 5 inches low and .75 inch right at 100 yards. Keeping the rifle steady, I adjusted the scope about 5 inches below point of impact. 2nd shot hit 1inch left and 5 inches low at 350 yards. I adjusted the scope 10 clicks up. 3rd shot hit 11 inches low at 450 yards. I adjusted the scope up 12 clicks. 4th shot hit 17 inches low at 504 yards.  Later in the day when the wind died off I shot a 3 shot group at 500 yards that measured 9 inches. The barrel is cleaning up better now so next weekend I will shoot a fouling shot and then a 3 shot group at 500 yards. I'm going to order a set of dies so I can play with the seating depth, and try a little more powder next time I reload shells.      I hope to get the rifle to shoot better, hopefully under 1 moa out to 600 or 700 yards.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on April 30, 2017, 06:31:44 PM
   On Saturday I adjusted the scope up 22 more clicks and shot a 3 shot group at 600 yards. It measured just under 5 inches. Today I adjusted the scope up 25 clicks and shot at 715 yards. Bullets landed 8 inches apart but I think I can do better. I will try again next weekend. I'm going to pull the action from the stock and adjust the trigger down a little more and lube it on the 4 points the owners manual recommends. Next weekend I'm going to try 800 yards. I don't have a clue how many clicks to go up or if the scope has enough clicks to get it to 800 yards.    The barrel is cleaning up really nice now and the action is smoothing out a little, but it has a long way to go.  The more I shoot the rifle the less I like the stock but it is a lot better then the original. The recoil pad is so soft that the rifle jumps to the right every shot. I have 27 rounds through it now.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on April 30, 2017, 08:14:28 PM
Sounds pretty impressive for only 27 rounds through it and no optimization of your load yet - with a bit of experimentation there I would bet you could cut those groups down considerably, and you're already in the 1 MOA ballpark.  Interested in hearing how this progresses, keep the updates coming.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 01, 2017, 08:00:19 PM
 Mad       I think I might of got lucky on the load I'm using. I bought some Benchmark powder for a .204 Ruger project awhile ago and it didn't work out in the .204. I noticed that Benchmark was a popular powder for the .308 so I tried it. I figured it would be a way to use up the Benchmark powder if nothing else. It seems to be working in my rifle. I am using a Rem 9 1/2 magnum primer too.  I normally try to have the bullet very close to the lands but in this rifle they wont fit in the magazine that long.    I am going to work on my form and try to get my self steadier because my goal is, 3 shots in a 8 inch group at 800 yards.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 06, 2017, 07:17:18 AM
Not - Sounds about right, one MOA that is really good, to shoot 8 inch at 800 yards...I have never shot my 308's past 250 yards and last year's Summerblast shot my Custom Cooper at 325 yards...hit the 12 inch plate the first and only time....I have settle in using Viht 140 or 540 powder, 155 Gn Berger Bullets, Lapua Brass, CCI-BR2 primers...but barrels have 12 twist in them....

I agree with Mad that it is very impressive just after 27 shots.....you are doing it right. I think after 300 yards I would go to a larger Caliber like a 270 or 270 WSM or larger. I have an 7mm Rem Mag that loves 140 gns pills!!! I know it is a screamer, plan on putting it though the Labradar and the Magneto Speed 2.0 Chronographs this spring but the knee got in the way, maybe in late July or August I can make it happen.

I own 19 - 308's barrel lengths from 19" to 26" and most are 10 and 12 twist....all of the shoot very, very well.....good enough to take a deer at 300 yards, no problem! But after 300 yards, have a bunch of 270's, 280's and 30-06's to use and after 600 yards have 270WSM and larger calibers to take care of business out past 600.....

I would not use Benchmark for anything smaller than 243 that is JMO. As far as the seating goes, I start out at .020 and go from there just depends of how the rife shoots. I will try different powders and amounts of to try and get the group down and when I do find a good potential load, then is when I will start playing with the lands...tell you want .005 makes a big difference!!     
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 06, 2017, 09:07:32 PM
Bo, Benchmark is currently my best powder for my Ruger M77 in .223.  it has a slow twist and I'm running 40 grain pills in it.  Had good results with H335, but Benchmark is beating it.  For my AR though, it's 60 gr Sierra hollow points and Varget.  Also tried H335 and CFE223 in the AR, but results were not great, especially with the CFE.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 07, 2017, 07:13:49 PM
   I adjusted the turret up to 96 clicks. I set up at 805 yards shooting into a quartering wind of about 10 mph and missed the target. My target is 2 pcs of 1/4 inch steel welded together so its 1/2 inch thick and 24 inches square. Between the target stand and the steel plate I put a big piece of cardboard so if I miss the steel plate I can see where I hit. I had removed the stock to adjust the trigger and tightened screws back to 60 in lbs. I had also cleaned the barrel and this was my fouling shot. My second shot hit the plate but I was shooting into the sun and couldn't see where I hit so I drove the Ranger down to take a look. My second shot I held 12 inches left of the bullseye because of wind drift and hit the plate 18 inches to the right of my point of aim. My first shot was 7 inches to the right of the plate on the cardboard. I was shooting a little high so I adjusted the scope down 1 click and fired 3 shots again at 805 yards. I held about 20 inches left of the bullseye. All 3 shots were lined up perfectly vertical. 1 shot was 4 inches left of the bullseye, another was 6 inches below the first and the other shot was 11 inches above the first. I was disappointed in my group but I now know that 95 clicks will put me on the plate at 800 yards. The wind got worse so I waited for a day with less wind but it kept blowing for the next 2 days so I didn't shoot anymore. The next 5 weekends I will be fishing Walleyes in Canada so I don't know when I will be able to shot again. 32 rounds down the barrel.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 22, 2017, 07:08:02 PM
I haven't got to shoot anymore but I did talk to a gunsmith about rebarreling the 308. Tomarrow I am going to confirm the build sheet with the gunsmith and give him a deposit to get the barrel ordered. I am going with a Shilen barrel either 26 or 27 inches. The twist will be either 1 in 7.75 inches or 1 in 8 inches. The barrel contour will be the same as a Rem varmint rifle is so stocks are easy to get. Cartridge is a 6mm Creedmore. Using a 105 to 110 grain VLD bullet the creedmore can still be magazine fed. This will be a 1000 yard gun. The barrel won't be ready to install until late July so I can keep shooting the 308 until then.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 22, 2017, 09:18:14 PM
Notsams - You will be pleased with the Shilen and the round...very good, round you have picked, love the 6mm round...

Thanks for the update...please keep us in the loop....
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 23, 2017, 08:09:53 PM
The gunsmith ordered a Shilen barrel and will be finished to 26 inches. 1 in 7.75" twist, stainless steel. 6mm Creedmoor cartridge. The gunsmith will square the front of the action, lap the lugs, chase the threads and make sure the bottom of the action is perfectly round. The cartridge and twist rate will be engraved into the barrel also. I went with a standard barrel contour so a better stock will be easy to get when and if I decide to upgrade. The stock I have will be good for some Coyote hunts but if I want to get serious about little groups at long range a new stock is in order and probably a different scope.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 24, 2017, 06:16:59 AM
Yari - The only thing left is the make sure your gunsmith uses the same lathe to square up the new Shilen barrel when it comes in...true the action and bolt face, lapped the locking lugs. Yes sounds like he has done this before...LOL...

What contour on the barrel did you go with?? the Standard Barrel Contour is a number 2 or 3 contour?? My standard is a number 4 barrel as a minimum. I had a Custom Cooper built a few years ago and it has a #6 barrel on it, short but heavy....

Cannot wait to see some pictures of your new rifle.....
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 24, 2017, 07:30:21 PM
   BO I went with the standard Rem Varmint contour to make getting stocks simple. I'm looking at a stock on sale at Stockys website. Stockys sells a bunch of different brand stocks and has there own line of stocks for sale too.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 30, 2017, 08:43:30 PM
   I finally did some more shooting with the 308. The wind has been blowing everyday for weeks it seems. I was shooting East and there was a NW wind of 15 mph. The wind blew my bullets 24 inches to the right at 600 yards. I was shooting over the hood of my pickup and did manage a couple good groups.  I ordered a laminated stock for the rifle that was on sale. The stock is a vertical grip design with a aluminum bedding block. It weighs 3 pounds so it will add a little weight and be more comfortable on the bench. I think I will wait till I get the 6mm Creedmoor barrel installed before putting the stock on. I don't know if I will upgrade the rings and bases or not, but they seem to be working good. I'm definitely going to keep the Hogue over mold stock I have on the rifle now. It would probably be a better choice for hunting with the 6mm Creedmoor. But in reality I probably wont hunt much with the 6mm Creedmoor other the Coyotes.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on June 21, 2017, 08:51:09 PM
  I shot the 308 again the other day after putting on the Laminated stock and taller rings. The rifle shoots high now. I had to drop down 4 clicks to hit center at 600 yards. I did manage 4 shots into a 5 inch group. I have 17 more shells loaded to shoot and that is it. I hope to get it back on target at 800 yards this weekend before I run out of ammo. When I run out of ammo it will go to the gunsmith for rebarreling. When I get it back from the gunsmith I am going to put a Leupold Vx2, 6-18 power AO scope on it. It is the highest power scope I own. I will also get a custom turret made when I have a load developed. I have enjoyed the 308 win but it is time to move on to the 6mm Creedmoor.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on June 25, 2017, 06:35:15 PM
   I shot the 308 again this morning. I shot at 600, 715 and 800 yards. At 800 yards the wind was blowing my bullets about 22 inches to the right. I took my time and shot 3 shots at 800 yards. 2 shots were almost touching and the 3rd shot was 3.5 inches lower. That is the best group I have shot with this rifle. I think that it was really lucky and I probably could never do it again but I did it once so I am happy. 4 shells left.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on June 27, 2017, 11:29:46 AM
nice shooting. 6x18 is a long ranger. what is the minimum you can shoot and still have a good sight picture at 6x?
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on June 27, 2017, 03:29:22 PM
Notsams - Good shooting in high wind!! One thing to watch is the wind, just like the golfers a few mph can throw off the shot enough for a miss or a wound, and we certainly don't want that! Is this going to be your hunting rifle and if so, how far of a shot are you going to take with it?? just wondering.......I own 20 308's and my limit on the Coopers with 24" and 26" barrels is 400 yards and the rest with 18", 20" to 22" Barrels will be 200 yards and if conditions are right then 300 yards.....being Mr. Conservative, these are my self imposed limits, always want to dispatch the animal with the first shot....
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on June 27, 2017, 08:05:29 PM
yari the scope has an adjustable objective so it can be fine tuned. I would have to guess but probably 50 yards on 6 power.                       
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on June 27, 2017, 08:20:10 PM
Not - nice shooting sir!  half MOA in the wind is not anything to be ashamed of - hope you can find a calm day soon so you can really evaluate your full potential with that rifle.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on June 27, 2017, 08:39:10 PM
Bo this rifle is going to be rebarreled to a 6mm creedmoor.  I Am delivering the rifle to the gunsmith tomorrow. He will install a Shilen barrel over the next couple weeks. He is also going to tune the action a little too. The 6mm Creedmoor is going to be a bench gun. I hope to use it as a tool for improving my shooting abilities and stretch my range out to 1000 yards.      I enjoyed playing with the 308 win. I have more respect for the round now then before this project. Even at 800 yards the 308 puts dents in my steel target. My only complaint about it is that the recoil is enough that I can't keep a sight picture to watch the bullet hit at any distance under 800 yards. At 800 yards I have time to get back on target and see the bullet hit. A muzzle break would easily fix the recoil issue.         I got a better deal on loaded ammo then buying just brass so I have 100 rounds of Hornady Match Ammo ordered. I will shoot this and then use the brass to reload. The Hornady ammo is loaded with the 108 grain ELD match bullet which is my bullet of choice for the 6mm Creedmoor so I hope it works out.             I think I'll play with my old 243 ruger until I get my rifle back from the gunsmith.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 05, 2017, 05:26:26 PM
I dropped off the rifle last week at the gunsmith. When he ordered the barrel from Shilen they recommended the 1 in 7 inch twist for the 108 gr bullets so that is what we are installing on the Rem action.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 05, 2017, 07:19:43 PM
Not - Wow a 6mm CM...good choice and flat shooting....Yes, Shilen is a good quality barrel that has been around for over 50 years now. I have an original Shilen DGA original, ordered in May 1981 and Delivered to the customer in Dallas in Sept 81....I got it back in the 2005 from a Preacher Man who lived in Shreveport, LA...he has bought it from an estate sale about in 2000. I am the third owner of this rifle and the Preacher Man sent me 7 hand-loads that he used, all with great success. I only use 5 loads, all of them shoot dime groups...

How much is this "bench gun"going to weigh?? and what kind of trigger are you going with?? I would put a Jewell in it at 2 to 4 ounce pull on it...what contour of Shilen barrel are you getting?? and how long is the barrel...sounds like a #5 barrel and about 28" long with a 1 in 7 twist in it....since you are going to build one, you might think about finding someone in your home town that will hand load your bullets for you?? I know there are a few of them in my town, but since I load my own there is no need.....No need to lap the barrel when you get it, it should be lapped and ready to go....if you decide to buy ammo from it be sure to check out the lot numbers on the inside of the box flap....this may require you to visit you local store and asked them to see all the 6mm CM Ammo they have in stock and pick out the same lot numbers for at least 500 rounds....

I would say that a muzzle brake will fix your recoil problem sort of....Save your brass. Hornady makes some pretty good ammo with the ELD match ammo...

You have done it right...I plan on using my Savage 10BA 6.5 CM for hunting purposes. Will start with a 140 gn Berger and Nosler pills but will drop down to 129 gn if I have too.....Should be a good year for both of us.....   
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 09, 2017, 07:45:47 PM
BO      I guess it may be better to call this an "economy" bench gun. I have not got it back from the gun smith but with the aftermarket stock it is over 10 pounds. Dropping down from 30 caliber to 24 caliber with the same barrel contour will add a little weight. The barrel should finish out about 26 inches when he is done. To go longer would of cost more and I didn't think a few more inches would of really did anything for me. As for the trigger. I have the original 700 trigger adjusted down to 2.6 lbs. It is the Pro X trigger and is easy to adjust using only 1 screw. It's fine for now but may be upgraded later. This rifle will see a little use as a Coyote gun this winter, but won't get far from the pickup because of the weight.      I do reload but brass is still limited now because only Hornady is making it, and they are the only one offering it as loaded ammo right now as far as I can tell. I bought 5 boxes of match ammo with the same lot numbers. I ordered them from Ammo Seekers .com. If I would of ordered the components to reload I would of saved $4. Counting these 5 boxes of ammo, I have only bought 8 boxes of factory rifle ammo in my lifetime. I sure hope these shoot great out of my rifle, this is the bullet I want to use.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 24, 2017, 06:46:38 AM
Not - How is the rifle project going?? I generally don't shoot any factory ammo in the rifles unless it just for getting it on paper at 100 yards, maybe 6 to 8 shots and then will switch over to hand loads after two or three trips to the range...

Any news or pictures you can post??
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 24, 2017, 08:16:31 PM
BO I have not called the gunsmith yet because he said it should be ready by Wednesday of this week so I will call him in a couple days. I hope it is ready soon. I've been shooting my 243 a little but can't wait to try out the 6mm Creedmoor. I'm hoping to get out to 1000 yards with this rifle and make 1st round hits at that distance on my 24 inch steel target.  I've already started thinking of my next project. A 6.5x284 but going to wait and see how this project turns out first.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 25, 2017, 06:07:33 AM
Good idea to see how this one will turn out first! I love the two 243's that shoot the 100 gn pill. Both are tack driver, meaning also the same hole at 100 yds. Surprising me the most is a Ruger International M77, RSI model with its 18.5 inch barrel...would love to get a 6mm Rem Varmint Model 700 or old Ruger #1. That would be nice, since the 6mm is base off of the 7x57 case....

I have been talking to my local gun shop and they are willing to build a custom 26 Nosler for ????, we have not started talking about price yet....they are the same folks that are going to build a 22 Nosler Upper Assembly including the bolt carrier....Not sure if I want a custom 26 Nosler or another Cooper in 26 Nosler or a Nosler Heritage in 26 Nosler....

Thanks for the update....

 
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 25, 2017, 07:44:22 PM
Bo  I did call the gunsmith today and the rifle is done except he has to get the barrel engraved before I can pick it up. He will contact the engraver this week.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 26, 2017, 06:06:00 AM
Notsams - OK was wondering about the progress of your build.....thanks...
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 26, 2017, 06:20:10 PM
Bo    Thanks for your interest and input. my trigger finger is starting to twitch.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 31, 2017, 07:56:30 PM
   Well I picked up the 6mm Creedmoor today and I'm impressed. The gunsmith made the action really smooth compared to when I dropped it off. He lapped the locking lugs and made sure the action was squared on the front. he also added a new and thicker recoil lug and machined the aluminum bedding block so it fit. Tomarrow I will get the scope mounted and boresight the scope. I hope to shoot steel on Thursday evening.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on July 31, 2017, 08:27:19 PM
very nice. send a pic of the final product
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on August 01, 2017, 06:20:06 AM
Not - Soon, very soon you will be headed to the range with the newbie...cannot wait to see how it groups and what it likes....
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on August 02, 2017, 07:39:04 PM
   The gunsmith told me an interesting story when I picked up my rifle. He had a guy drop off a target rifle in .243 win and wanted to see if he could make it shoot better. The guy dropped off a box with bullets, powders and primers. To make a long story short he did some research and experimenting and ended up shooting 5 shots into 3 inches at 600 yards using 105 gr Amax bullet. Heres the kicker, he used H1000 powder.  Yep h1000.  I thought that was unusual.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on August 03, 2017, 07:00:57 AM
Notsams - You are not going to believe this but many years ago I picked up a 243 Ruger International with a 18.5" barrel, cutest rifle and was loading up the normal book load for it. When I was working in KY for almost 5 years, was member of the famous Knob Creek for 4 years and would occasionally stop at Ft Knox and shot....Would pick out four rifles to take up to KY each week. Would drive back down each Thursday would arrive late in the evening, unload the rifles and load up four more, did this for almost 4 years as well...

Had the Ruger up there that week and I had been trying to find a load for it for years and years...it would make a perfect Youth/Female rifle because of the LOP is has, very short...but this guy (a Robert Redford look alike) saw me shooting and like any shooter you meander over to check out his/her rifles, so I was telling him that I really do like the rifle but cannot get it to shoot good groups. He said that he had some magic bullets that he had worked up the a great load with so he went back down and brought me back three rounds...

I shot these three rounds at 100 yards and holy cow all three touched! Wow, but he would tell me the load until after I shot the three rounds using a 100 gn Sierra GK....He smile when he told me that he was using 42.0 gns of IMR4831...I said what, that is a slow burning powder and the reloading books don't recommend that powder at all...but you cannot argue with results....have been using that load on two of my four 243's the ones that like the 100 to 105 gn pills.

Another story is about another Ruger M77 in 270 Winchester that was my second 270 rifle that I purchased in the early 80's...had it up in KY at Knob Creek one week and was getting 1.5 to 2" groups at 100 yards...was using 130 GN Nosler BT with 52.5 Gns of IMR4350...I mean it would nail a deer at 100 yards in the woods but it was not shooting the way I wanted it to shoot, 1/2" to 1" is acceptable to me at that distance....again we all were comparing rifles and mentioning to him that I was getting about 2"groups from this rifle and have tired so many different loads using IMR4350 that I was totally frustrated. He suggested using H4350 same load but just switch powders...humm...so came home (to TN) and loaded up about 10 rounds of 130 Gn BT using the H4350 and took it back the following week and shot a 1/2" group with it..over and over again...

The moral of both stories is that you never know what will work with your rifle!         

Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on August 03, 2017, 07:05:57 PM
I still consider myself a reloading newbie but fully agree with that.  I've been blown away with the significant differences powders are yielding between three different .223's I've been playing with in the last couple of years.  Have all three shooting great now, but with three different powders.  Will keep tinkering to see if I can find a common load for 2 of the 3, but pretty convinced I'll never get down to one load for all three at this point.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on August 07, 2017, 06:48:54 PM
     Well I shot the 6mm creedmoor this weekend and it is looking pretty good. I cleaned the barrel after every 2 shots for the first 10 shots. I have 16 rounds threw the rifle and the 8th, 9th, 10th and 11th were at 800 yards. The last 5 shots were at 900 yards. 4 shots printed a 7 inch group but 1 shot was 10 inches above the group. I have my shooting bench in the back of my Polaris ranger so I can move around and still see above the brush in the CRP field where I shoot and it is impossible to get rock steady. I am shooting the 108 gr Hornady ELD match bullet and I'm surprised how hard it hits at 900 yards. It dents my steel target so I think the bullets are really hard. The recoil is almost nothing and the muzzle blast is not bad either.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on August 09, 2017, 07:13:11 AM
Notsams - thanks for the update...for me and this is just me, I feel like a 100 gn pill is the minimum size pill that I would use on a deer...A few years ago a 10 year old with a Handy Rifle in a 243 nail a 10 pointer using a 100 gn pill...but that is a good group 7" at 900 yards very good.

That is a cool idea of the shooting bench on the back of your Polaris, how bout posting some pictures of your shooting bench so Metalman can make one of his own and show the rest of us at the BCSC hunting club....

So your 6mm CM has a brake on it?? Why?? the 6mm CM doesn't have much of a recoil anyway, just wondering...

Bo
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on August 09, 2017, 07:31:07 PM
    Bo  nope there is no muzzle break on the rifle it is not needed. I actually forgot to put my ear plugs in and fired 2 rounds before I noticed.   A friend of mine has a Lead sled I am going to borrow to see if I can get steadier with it. I just want to see what the rifle is capable of with my human error out of the equation. I like having to shoot without a perfect rest because it is more realistic to hunting conditions I think, but I need to get steadier if I'm going to shoot out to 1200 yards. I have a work weekend planned but will sneak in a few shots on sunday if I can find somewhere to stretch it out further.    I will try to post a picture but haven't been able to in the past.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on August 20, 2017, 06:54:10 PM
UNBELIEVABLE     I shot the 6mm creedmoor on Thursday evening after work. I shot at 1000,1100,and 1200 yards. I adjusted the scope 14 clicks and hit low at 1000 so adjusted 4 more clicks and shot 2 shots 5 inches apart. I adjusted 18 clicks and shot 2 shots at 1100 yards about 7 inches apart. At 1200 yards I adjusted 20 clicks and put 3 in the center of my steel target that averaged out at 6 inches. I called the gunsmith and told him he did a great job on the rifle as I stood by the target. Friday morning it was foggy at 7am so I waited till 8 and tried 1300 yards but didn't hit in for shots. I moved up to 1200 yards and with the same scope setting as the evening before I hit 25 inches low and 6 inches to the right. I wonder if it was the humidity that caused it to shoot low and right or if it was something I did.  This morning I set up a taller target to help me figure out how many clicks to adjust and moved to 1320 yards or 3/4 of a mile. After about 5 shots I figured it out and shot a 3 shot group that averages out under 6 inches. From 1200 yards to 1320 yards I had to adjust my scope over 30 clicks to hit center. My rifle is zeroed at 300 yards and to hit at 1320 yards I have to adjust it up 168 clicks. That is almost 3 complete spins of the turret. I am going to call Leupold to ask how many spins I can go before I wreck something.      The lead sled really helped me get steady and I am shooting in a different spot so I have my shooting bench on the ground not in the back of my wheeler too. 40 rounds fired. Barrel cleaned 8 times. THIS RIFLE REALLY SHOOTS!
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on August 20, 2017, 07:33:54 PM
you have a shooter there. 168 clicks? you better bring a pen and paper so you don't miss count. congrats
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on August 21, 2017, 09:31:34 PM
Sounds like you have a great combination of rifle, scope, and ammo (and shooter) there Not - congratulations!  Lots of things come into play at that range, I'm sure you'll continue to tighten those groups even more as you learn all about the variables.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 04, 2017, 07:23:44 PM
   I can't get to 1400 yards with my scope setup. I ordered a 20 moa base to get some more clicks out of the scope. hopefully I can get to 1500 yards then.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 05, 2017, 07:20:24 AM
Notsams - Wow - that is a long way out there....you certainly are set up with the rifle, but what about the ammo, check out the ammo, may have to go with even a heavier gn pill....I cannot image hunting with that rifle....mirage, wind, spin drift, temperature, humidity, BP, elevation are among the factors you have to considered...I know I am hunting and will not shoot a critter out past 400 yards...even that is a long way to be able to determine if you want to try and take this animal....so I cannot image doing your own long range pursuit show.....I ran into a long range shooter many years ago that shot only 243 Win and he told me that the farther out you shoot, the heavier the bullet has to be...make sense to me then and still does....

If you want to try a 30 or 40 MOA base then you might want to swap out the base but if you do you got to start all over again and work you way out.....if you plan on using this rifle this year's hunting season you may want to go back and put a 40 MOA base on it and then limit yourself to a 500 yard distance to the critters. Then after the season start working on a 1500 yard load, which will be different from the 500 yard load....

The reason why I limit myself to 400 yards is because I know I can a clean ethical shot on a deer....Dutch once told me he hit a running coyote at 1200 yards and had 5 witness...now that is shooting....but there are few Dutch's and PA's in this world.....just my opinion....

 

Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 05, 2017, 08:32:54 PM
Bo  this rifle will see a little hunting this winter for coyotes and that is it. I am not going to shoot at big game animals at extreme long range, but if a coyote sits out in the middle of a section and gives me the time to get ready then I will shoot long range at a Coyote.    I am just trying to get to 1500 yards with this rifle for my own satisfaction. I hope that with the 20 MOA base that I can get enough extra clicks to get to 1500 yards. I eventually want to shoot out to 1 mile but will probably need a different setup for that.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 05, 2017, 08:43:20 PM
You've come a long way in a short time already with great results - hang in there, you'll get it.  Keep us updated when you try out that new mount!
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 06, 2017, 07:40:43 PM
  Mad,   thanks it has been fun and I'm only getting started to enjoy the 6mm Creedmoor. I haven't had much time to shoot lately but hope to install the base and shoot a little this weekend hopefully.     
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 06, 2017, 11:26:15 PM
Notsams - You and Dutch are our long range guys....that is amazing that you shoot yotes that far...wow....there has been a lot of talk about the 6mm CM....all positive....
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 26, 2017, 07:00:25 PM
BO  the farthest I have ever shot a Coyote is 576 yards but I will shoot further if given a chance.   I put on the 20 MOA base. My rifle is sighted in 1 inch high at 100 yards and after the new base install it was 14 inches low and 4 inches left. 52 clicks and the rifle was 1 inch high again.   Shooting at 600 yards, 2 shots hit  7 inches high.  At 800 yards, 2 shots hit center. At 1000 yards, 1 shot hit 12 inches low. It is painfully obvious that I need to gather new data but the weather has been terrible here lately so I need to wait for better conditions before I try shooting to 1400 or 1500 yards.     I'm leaving for a mule deer hunt in about 3 weeks so I need to dust off the 7mm mag and practice with it some too. I have a custom dial on it but I would like to gather some wind drift data if the conditions are right. I also want to practice shooting from shooting sticks before the hunt.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 28, 2017, 06:26:39 AM
In my opinion, any shots taken beyond 600 yards needs to be off rest.

My longest off hand moving target shot was 676 on an antelope. My longest off rest shot was 1135 on a running coyote. Both of which I attribute more to luck than skill.

Also in my opinion the 6.5 bullets are going to run out of steam between 1700 -2100 yards to have any knock-down power on medium to heavy skinned animals.

Your shot at 100 hitting 12" low leads me to believe that a shot at 1500 will hit 32" or so low.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on September 28, 2017, 07:48:35 AM
Thanks Dutch, that is good info to use...on my 6.5 CM have it sighted in at 1.5 to 2 inches high at 200 yards...so I think I will be good to about 600 yards. Still that is a long way for the South even with our land timbered/cleared.....deer are traveling at a fast pace when they are in the open down here....

Going to take the 26 Nosler to the range for the first time this afternoon...going to get it on paper at 50 then 100 and hopefully 200 yards today, with barrel break-in procedure in place, might be at the range a long time today.....will post the results.....

Thanks Notsams for the info, I don't think we have the observation distance that you guys do.....576 yards - now that is a long ways out there!! Shooting at 600 yards off the bench and using rest is a chip shot for you and Dutch, but for us guys in the South, that is unheard of unless you have a stand on a power line of gas line...I remember way back in the early 80's I saw 17 deer on opening morning on a stand I have on a power line and the deer were probably 400 to 600 yards away, trotting across the power line, no time to put the cheapie binoculars I had back then on them...LOL...

Please you and Dutch keep us posted on those long shots you guys pull off!!! it is amazing to hear about them....I could only imagine...
 
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on October 01, 2017, 06:26:04 PM
BO I am not in the same league as Dutch, not even close.  My 6mm creemoor is not a long range hunting tool other then for varmints. it is mainly a gun to use to hone and learn my shooting skills. I do not go out looking for long range shots at big game.       The weather was very gusty and rainy here so didn't shoot the 6mm creedmoor this weekend but did shoot the 7mm 4 times.  2 shots at 600 yards and 2 shots at 800 yards. all shots hit steel but were mixed in with other bullet strikes so group sizes were difficult to figure.   I repainted the target for next time.    I have to shoot out of the back of my wheeler again because of the tall grass in the crp field, so I will sit in the back of the ranger and shoot on shooting sticks out to 600 yards just to see how I do.   If the wind cooperates I will use my bench to gather wind drift data too.           The Leupold Custom Dial System (CDS) is as slick as it gets for a hunter. I haven't shot the 7mm since last fall and all I had to do was dial it to the proper yardage and squeeze the trigger.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on October 07, 2017, 09:52:28 PM
Notsams - I agree with your assessment.....Remember that any CDS type system is based on one bullet and hopefully you go it dialed in to under 1 moa before ordering your custom CDS system from Leupold....I know they work very well.....
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on October 08, 2017, 07:07:06 PM
    Bo  I Really like the CDS setup on my rifles, it is easier then just counting clicks.     I have a piece of paper with my turret info slid into the barrel channel of my 6mm Creedmoor so if I have the rifle the data is with it.  It is really confusing trying to count out the clicks, especially when going 4 full turns or counting out 232 clicks.         I did get new data figured out for 1000 yards to 1500 yards with the 6mm Creedmoor. Even after putting a 20 moa base on I still can only get to 1500 yards. ( I only have 15 more clicks when sighted in for 1500 yards)   I didn't shoot groups, just enough shots to get centered hits or very close. A pattern starts to show up.    I was shooting into the wind and it was picking up rapidly but my bullets kept going to the right so every 200 yards I had to go 2 clicks left or the bullets would of missed the target.   I still can't get over how good this rifle shoots. At 1300, 1400 and 1500 yards the first rounds shot hit within 6 inches of the bullseye.      I'm looking into a level for the rifle that attaches to the picitiny rail. 
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on December 06, 2017, 06:51:25 PM
     I put a different scope on the 6mm Creedmoor but still can't dial up to 1760 yards. I have a 20 moa base on it now and was going to put on a 40 moa base but they are $120 and I don't want to spend that on a base I may not want in the future so I decided to "shim" the base. I cut apart an old "feeler" gauge and put a total of .040 inch under the base and carefully snugged it back down. The next chance I get I will shoot it to see how much difference it made at 100 yards and then maybe work my way out till I run out of scope clicks again.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on December 06, 2017, 07:28:44 PM
Not, how does that .040" of shim height compare to the height differential on the 20 MOA base by itself?  I haven't attempted to do the math, but .040" in addition to the 20 MOA seems like it ought to eliminate a lot of clicks at long range.

One thing to watch out for - I would assume with that "tilt" you're going to have some bending stress in the mount bolts and also having the heads sitting a bit tipped in the counterbore of the mount, so that might make things creep around a bit with repeated recoil cycles.  It will at least tell you if the higher MOA mount is taking you to the range you need, but might give you fits in terms of holding zero shot after shot.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on December 07, 2017, 07:06:17 PM
Mad Yea I hope to find out this weekend how much difference it will make at 100 yards. I think the wind is going to blow so might not get to shoot long range.          As for the "tilt, I am concerned too.  I was very careful when I tightened the screws and I placed the shim in between the back 2 screws and they snugged down nicely. The farthest front screw snugged down good but I was afraid the 2nd screw from the front would bend the base because of the gap under it. I slipped a  shim under the 2nd screw so I wouldn't bend the base. I did not torque down the screws as much as I would have but I think it should work. I have not done this before so it is all a test. I Don't know if it will work out but it's fun trying.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on December 08, 2017, 04:10:13 PM
Not, I have attached a PDF of 3 different trajectory charts for 6mm Creed. The muzzle velocity I used was 2960 fps for the 108 ELD Honady. I don't know your exact velocity just picked a fairly common one for a 26" tube. I used 400, 600 and 800 zero ranges in the tables.

Doing the math on your VX2 you have 67 MOA elevation adjustment. With a 800 zero range you should have almost enough adjustment to reach 1800. 400 & 600 would net 1500-1600.

I'm not sure if your VX has any graduation marks on the vertical crosshair line below center horizontal line. I try to get scopes with these "cheater" hash marks and use them as calibrated holdover marks. Sometimes at extreme range my target is not in my FOV. I use the vertical line to mark a POA above the target along this axis. Yes it takes several rounds and an understandingly patient spotter to help mark the POI so I can make adjustments to POA. MANY MANY more misses than hits in the beginning.

The long range mistress is a demanding lady but worth the trials and tribulations when that steel goes BOING. Welcome to the club. Let the yotes roll!
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on December 10, 2017, 03:07:02 PM
Dutch Thanks for the interest and info.   A few weeks ago I replaced the VX2 and put on a VX3i to get more adjustment and more power and a side focus for getting a clearer picture at long range. This scope has 80 MOA of adjustment. As stated in a earlier post I have a 20 MOA base and have placed a .040 shim under the base. I fired 1 shot at 100 yards and the bullet hit 13 inches high and 1.5 inches left. I adjusted the scope down and at 35 clicks it stopped, so I fired 1 shot and it hit 4.5 inches high at 100 yards. Now I should have 80 moa of adjustment to go up. Next weekend if everything works out and the weather cooperates I will try to get on target at 1 mile.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on December 17, 2017, 05:59:29 PM
     Well it was a beautiful day today. I shot at 1000, 1200 and 1400 yards. All the shots landed about 40 inches high. I then went to 1600 yards and missed the target. The wind was picking up and I decided to try again when I had a spotter to hide in the woods so I don't have to drive back and forth after every shot.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on December 27, 2017, 09:35:58 AM
   Its -25 here and I'm stuck inside. I am going to clean the 6mm Creedmoor and put it in the safe till spring. I still have 4 days to try shoot a deer with the bow and then I'll hunt Coyotes till spring. I've really enjoyed the 6mm Creedmoor project and it's far from over. I still want to shoot a group at 1 mile with it . Then I'll get a custom turret made for it out to 1000 yards and it will become my winter pickup gun for Coyotes.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on January 14, 2018, 07:48:44 PM
  I fired 3 shots through a crony today and got 3040,3030 and 3048 fps. That's an average of 3039 fps. I also pulled a bullet from the hornady match ammo and the powder charge weighed 40.2 gr. It is a short cut extruded powder.  I also sent a email to Hornady asking if they will tell me the powder they use in their match ammo. I don't think they will but I thought I would ask anyway. The factory ammo is unbelievably accurate, so if I can duplicate their ammo it will save me lots of time.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on January 14, 2018, 07:57:38 PM
Pretty unlikely that Hornady will tell you their recipe - about as likely as Coca Cola or Kentucky Fried Chicken giving your their secrets.  :-)    Might be able to narrow it down a bit by comparing their load data (I have one of the Hornady manuals) and trying to identify powders that produce that velocity with that pill in that load weight (what pill are you using?).  Might also want to post a photo of the powder and see if one of the gurus here can give you some leads. 

Or if all else fails, just keep shooting that factory stuff!

Glad to hear you were able to do a little shooting - did you get a bit of a warmup this weekend up there?
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on January 14, 2018, 08:15:42 PM
Just had a need to run downstairs so looked at my Hornady manual while I was down by the bench - no 6 mm Creedmoor data there - :-(   But went to the Hornady site and found this pdf, includes load data for the 108 ELD.  I'd guess RL 16, 17, or perhaps that one in the middle (never heard of it).  Again, maybe if you can post a photo of the powder some of the gang here might be familiar enough with these three to say if it's a possibility.  Couldn't confirm what test barrel length Hornady used on this data set.

https://press.hornady.com/assets/site/hornady/files/load-data/6mm-creedmoor-all-data.pdf
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on January 15, 2018, 07:52:59 PM
Mad  Thanks for your help.    No it didn't warm up. Saturday morning it was -31.  I just had cabin fever so I worked thru it.     I agree on the reloader 16 or 17. I have some Reloader 19 and the powder is identical but  with reloader 19 it wouldn't get enough velocity with 40.2 gr.    I am using the 108 gr ELD match bullet. I really like the ammo but no I will definitely be reloading for the 6mm Creedmoor. I have about 15 rounds left and I hope to get it to 1 mile before I run out, but there is some Coyotes around that need to learn that sitting in the middle of a section might not be safe.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on January 15, 2018, 08:29:04 PM
Mad    I forgot to mention that 1 of the reasons I want to duplicate the factory load is because they are quiet to shoot. Sometimes I shoot 2 or 3 shots before I realize I'm no wearing ear plugs.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on January 15, 2018, 08:35:30 PM
Hornady replied to my email. They said they use a proprietary blend of commercial grade powders not available to us but recommended H4350 or Reloader 16.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on April 29, 2018, 08:08:56 PM
I finally had the conditions I needed to try the 6mm Creedmoor again. I set up a target so I would be shooting south on Friday evening. I shot at 1000, 1100, 1200 and 1300 yards before I ran out of light. I left the target up and at 6.30 Saturday morning I shot at 1400 yards then when I was ranging to find 1500 yards my battery died on my rangefinder. Saturday evening I shot at 1500, 1550 and 1600 yards before I ran out of light. On Sunday morning it was to windy to shoot. This is the 1st time I ever hit the target past 1500 yards. My shot at 1,600 yards landed 20 inches low of the bullseye so next time I shoot I will give it 5 clicks to bring it up 20 inches. Then another 22 clicks to put it on target at 1650 yards.      That's about 90 more inches of drop in only 50 yards.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on April 29, 2018, 08:14:25 PM
Very impressive - I can't imagine 1500 yard shots with the expectation of a hit, I clearly have a lot of work to do before I'm in that club.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on April 30, 2018, 11:43:48 AM
nice shooting. you must have a heck of a scope to be able to make those adjustments
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 06, 2018, 05:20:28 PM
   On Friday evening the wind was out of the north and I shoot to the South so we set up the target and started shooting. 1st shot was 1650 yards, 2nd was 1700 yards then my 3rd shot hit at 1760 yards.  I only had 1 more factory loaded round and I wanted to shoot a group. My bullet had hit 33 inches low and 4 inches left of the bullseye. I should of adjusted my scope up because my next shot missed the target. I might of missed the target by a inch or by feet I don't know but my 1st shot at 1 mile hit the target so I reached my goal.    My rifle is sighted in 4.5 inches high at 100 yards. With the .30 shim under the base and the scope is adjusted all the way down and is still 4.5 inches high. My adjustments equaled 95 feet in order to reach the target at 1 mile.      Last week while shooting at 1,550 yards my bullet hit a piece of 1/2 inch plywood and didn't penetrate it. The 6mm creedmoor is very accurate but doesn't have much energy left at long range.         Now I have to see if my handloads have the same long range potential that the factory loads do.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 06, 2018, 05:41:24 PM
long range there. never tried it since i don't have a place to try it.

it doesn't surprise me there was no penetration. 6MM is close to a 243 if i remember correctly. that's a lot to ask

congrats
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 06, 2018, 08:48:47 PM
Not - that's pretty impressive to hit the target at a mile, even if the slug didn't have enough steam left to penetrate plywood.  Congratulations - you've done a lot with that one box of ammo!
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 07, 2018, 07:45:29 PM
    Mad   I bought 100 rounds of factory Hornady match ammo last year. I have only bought about 12 boxes of rifle ammo in my life. The brass was really hard to get for the 6mm Creedmoor so I bought factory ammo for less then I could of bought the components to reload it. The Hornady match ammo is extremely accurate, I don't know if my handloads will be as good.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 13, 2018, 07:16:20 PM
    My handloads seem to be good. The Hornady ELD match 108 gr bullets shot a little better then the 107 gr Nosler Custom competition bullet. I fired 2 rounds of each at 600 yards and measured center to center. Hornadys were 3.25 inches and the Noslers were 3.75 inches apart. That's as good as I can shoot and next time the Noslers might shoot better. I have about 70 of the Hornadys left and then I have 240 of the Noslers to shoot.    I think I will stick with the Reloader 17 for a while too.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 13, 2018, 09:29:51 PM
Notsams - good you are letting your range results determine you loads, good for you....I do the same things.....the paper results say a lot of things to you....I like RL17 as well....I like all the RL powders.....

 
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on May 15, 2018, 07:21:54 PM
BO  is RL 17 high priced in your area?  They want $39 a pound here in the local hardware store.  I'm going to check prices in the area before buying any more.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on February 10, 2019, 04:49:42 PM
   I have been carrying the 6mm CM as my long range coyote gun this winter. I had a Custom Dial made for it by Leupold. The VX3I is a 8.5-25x50 with a 30 mm tube. It is a awesome scope. 3 spins on the custom dial is 1350 yards. Last weekend I walked in about 1/2 a mile to try call in some Coyotes I had seen that morning. I brought the 6 CM so if a long range shot presented itself I would be ready. When I got setup there was 3 coyotes in the field about 600 yards away. I played a Coyote Yodel and all 3 stood up but didn't come my way. I noticed a 4th Coyote in some CRP about 500 yards away but he wasn't interested either. I switched to a rabbit distress and he starting running my way. When he was 100 yards away I howled, he kept coming. at 75 yards and 50 yards I howled again but he didn't stop. He was locked in on my decoy. I touched off the 6mm CM at about 50 yards and the 108 gr ELDM blew a 6 inch hole in him  behind the shoulder. "it didn't exit". The other Coyotes started to slowly move away so I tried several different calls but nothing worked.  1 Coyote was out by the woods that ranged 897 yards. I dialed my scope 1 click under 900 yards and fired 3 shots. I missed all 3 times but by inches each time. I was laying in the snow bank shooting off my back pack. I dragged the Coyote back to my vehicle 1/2 a mile away, It was -3 degrees and almost dark when I got there but I was having a great afternoon.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on February 10, 2019, 05:12:25 PM
that's a good night. what do you do with them? are the hides worth anything these days?

nice work
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on February 10, 2019, 06:28:11 PM
Nice work with the 6mm CM , that bullet acts like my 40gr vmax out of my encore 223 it going 3700 muzzle volatility , comes apart on inpact .   @--0--0118
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on February 10, 2019, 07:49:48 PM
Yari    the fur buyer is coming to my area this weekend. I've been told they are worth $30 to $50 in the round. Up to $70 if they are a real pale color. 2 of mine are shot up bad but I will bring them and see what I can get.
Title: Re: rifle project
Post by: [Blocked] on February 10, 2019, 07:54:27 PM
Sundowner     This is suppose to be my long range gun. 500 yards and up. Under 500 yards I use a .243 with 55gr Ballistic tips at 4150 fps. Its a pretty good round.